Selling with Authentic Persuasion – Jason Cutter

 

Transcript:

Thu, Jun 30, 2022

SUMMARY KEYWORDS 
people , sales , salespeople , book , persuasion , talking , realized , authentic , open , analytical , jason , wrote , lead , business , sell , person , selling , speaking , podcast , money

SPEAKERS
Christopher Smith & Jason Cutter

Intro
Welcome to the Sales Lead Dog podcast hosted by CRM technology and sales process expert Christopher Smith, talking with sales leaders that have separated themselves from the rest of the pack. Listen to find out how the best of the best achieve success with their team and CRM technology. And remember, unless you are the lead dog, the view never changes.

Christopher Smith
Welcome to Sales Lead Dog. Today I have joining me Jason Cutter of Cutter Consulting Group. Jason, welcome to Sales Lead Dog.

Jason Cutter
Thanks for having me, Chris. I am super excited to be here. And any chance to talk to anyone about sales is always fun for me and also feels weird whenever I say that to think about it. So

Christopher Smith
You know what, I love it too. It’s one of the things when I started this podcast, I had no idea how much I was going to joy, sitting and listening. Every one of these is a masterclass for me, I love it. So, thanks again for coming on. Tell me about Cutter Consulting Group.

Jason Cutter
Well, it was born out of about 16 years’ experience inside telephone sales rooms running both sales and the lead gen side for call centers, mostly business to consumer. And what I learned over the years is what it takes to build scalable sales operations so scalable is instead of hiring 10 people and firing eight of them and hoping that you get the right people that know how to do it. It’s building a system and process that you can repeat, almost like a franchise, no matter how many offices no matter how many reps. So now companies hire me to do that for them to take them to the next level of their sales operation systems processes, dirty things like scripts that nobody wants to admit that are valuable, but they are and how that helps bridge the gap from where you are to where you want to be. And so, it involves a lot of that a lot of improving the tools they have putting in training, workshops, leadership development. You know, there’s a lot of organizations do the classic, let’s take our salespeople and promote them up with the managers and hope they know how to manage as well as they sold. And they leave them at that. And then that falls apart like a house of cards. So, I do a lot of stuff around that in helping organizations just succeed, you know, help their reps, close more deals, make more money, and then lower their attrition, their turnover, so that everyone can succeed the company and their clients.

Christopher Smith
That’s awesome. Now, Jason, you do a lot. You are not only a sales consultant, but you have a podcast, you’re an author, book is right there. For those of you watching on YouTube, you can see the book on the shelf behind himself with authentic persuasion. So, we’re going to talk about that. But let’s go back to the beginning. How did you get your start in sales? How did you start this journey?

Jason Cutter
Well, I, I went probably the route that? Well, let’s just say most people didn’t go, who are in my position as a consultant and author and podcaster and speaker, I got my bachelor’s degree in marine biology from UC Santa Cruz, the mighty banana slugs, and I tagged sharks for years. And I say that because it’s an interesting segue into how I got here. My childhood was filled with being an awkward, late blooming, shy, bullied child only child and the product of two very analytical parents, super loving, best parents. I’m so grateful. They’re still together. But my mom was a banker. And in finance, my dad was an engineer and in project management, and they moved their way up. And so, they’re both analytical. And given that my mom as the banker was also a huge, she really disliked salespeople because of what she saw in the bank, what she saw in her own life. And so, I was raised by analytical parents who really, really hated salespeople. Thus, I chose sharks that was a safer, better alternative and dealing with people in any career. Right? Yeah, different kinds of sharks are the real sharks that are, you know, actually easier to deal with. They have one thing on their mind, and they have one direction they go. And so, you just got to stay away from the business and keep your hands inside the vehicle at all times. And you know, you’re pretty good usually. I didn’t think I was good with people I didn’t really like people. wasn’t a huge fan. I didn’t want a career and dealing with people. Then life took many twists and turns. I was at Microsoft for a couple years doing tech support, because I realized, wait, I am pretty good with people and solving problems. That That ended and I realized that wasn’t for me. I’ve ended up in a sales role. It was in the mortgage business in 2002, which was the height of the real estate boom in Seattle, and across the country. And so, it was pure order taking I didn’t actually have to sell or learn anything about sales. So, I thought I was just helping people. I didn’t even realize I was in a sales job until years and years later. And that just kind of evolved and morphed from there into where I am now and what I had to teach myself along the way.

Christopher Smith
Before we talked about the book, I want to talk a little bit about your keynote speaking. How did you get into that?

Jason Cutter
It was actually a result of many things that kind of have happened over the years. When I was in my first management role in sales, I realized that I was doing management and training of new hires and constantly meeting, I realized that managing speaking to the group training, new hires, and also sales itself was a form of public speaking. And most people put public speaking ahead of even death as their number one fear. But I realized, like, if I wanted to get better at those things I would do, I should do public speaking, I should get better. So, I found out about Toastmasters. And I joined Toastmasters. And then that kicked off two years of going almost every week to a Toastmasters meeting, and if anyone’s not familiar with it, and you want to either get better at speaking, be a public speaker, or just get better at communicating even in a sales role. Toastmasters is where you go for fun, on a voluntary basis, not under court order to practice public speaking in front of other people. And it was great, it was fundamental and changed the way I saw speaking, and how I approached it, and what I stressed about. And I realized, like from then, and all the training I’ve done, that’s what I really like to do the most, right, I can sell. And I can do lots of things when it comes to selling, but I love teaching, I love that light bulb moment that people have when you teach them something, and they use it. And I part of the reason why I wrote my book was to have that vehicle to help with speaking and to give me content to speak about and just kind of tie that all together. And the unfortunate part was the plan was to have the book, launch the book, launch into speaking, pandemic happen. And so, the book came out in the silence of the pandemic. And I had to wait till this year to actually get on stage for the first time at conferences, which I’ve done now, I think eight times this year, so far. And yeah, it’s, it’s really great, you know, to speak to a crowd, get nervous before doing it, but love nothing more than just sharing, and helping people transform their opinions about sales and operations.

Christopher Smith
That’s great, especially when you’re doing the energy back and the feedback back from the crowd. That is a great feeling. So, selling with authentic persuasion. What does that mean to sell with authentic persuasion?

Jason Cutter
Well, I think and here’s what’s interesting is from when I wrote the book, to launching it, and then you know, talking to people about it, some people like the word, some people don’t like the words, you know, authenticity is a very, I’ll just say, an overused buzzword in the last couple of years where everyone’s trying to be authentic, and you should be authentic, and so has this, you know, some people really don’t like it, it’s funny how that comes up. For me, it’s both of those parts of the formula, authentic, and persuasion, are what’s required to be an effective sales professional. And again, there’s people kind of like, what I was talking about organizations, there’s people who fell into sales, kind of like myself, and they didn’t have a plan to be in sales, or they don’t know enough about sales other than the dirty gross experiences we’ve all had as a customer, or potential customer at the hand of salespeople. And I’m using air quotes, because when we when we put that label on it, it’s the gross label that people don’t want to use and don’t want to think about. So, for me, what I realized was the authentic persuasion framework and formula first starts with the authenticity, the person who’s in that selling role, must be authentic to who they are. Because what I see a lot of times, take myself, for example, I think sales is x, it’s this person, it’s this persona, it’s Wolf of Wall Street, its boiler room, like, that’s what it takes to sell. And so either what people try to do is they try to copy that thinking that’s what you should do, which please don’t, or they just do nothing at all, and they’re worried about being themselves because they think that’s not good enough. And in fact, the more authentic you can be to who you are and your strengths, like I’m the product of two analytical parents. I’m an analytical salesperson, I’m looking for the data. I’m like, I could have been a detective in a path in another life, where I just want to find it, what is the thing? And then how do I just run with that thing? That’s what my sales style is. And for the longest time, I thought that then I realized, Wait, that’s my superpower. That’s what I bring to potential clients is that value versus other people who are like happy hours and schmoozing and storytelling and charisma and all these other things, if that’s you, great. If it’s not, you don’t try to be that. And so that’s the authentic piece in a nutshell. There’s a lot more to it that I write about in the book, and train on and then there’s the persuasion piece because what happens in the subtitle to the book luck is transformed from order taker to codebreaker is there’s people again, myself, not just myself. But I saw, I’ve seen hundreds and hundreds of people in and out of sales over my career, where people act like order takers, and meaning they don’t have enough training, they don’t understand the mindset and the strategies and how to be an effective sales professional. And they know what’s gross. So instead, they just follow Bob Berg’s advice, which is get people to know like and trust them and leave it at that and hope that’s enough. But that’s not right. And so, the persuasion piece is the active pursuit of helping the right people across the finish line and leaving them in a better place, which is then the persuasion, so you have to put both of those. Now, what’s interesting is most people come to me and all they want to know is the persuasion piece. What do I have to say, to close more deals? How do I ask for the sale? How do I overcome objections, and I’m like, that doesn’t matter? Unless we deal with the authenticity piece and the foundation. Right? It’s like, if anyone were to buy me really expensive golf clubs, it would literally not change how terrible I am at golf. Right? That tool is in the wrong hands, I’ve got to work on the foundation, then we can deal with getting better clubs.

Christopher Smith
I’m glad you connected authenticity with foundation. Because as you were talking, that’s right, where my mind was going that if you don’t have that, that bottom layer that you’re building everything else on, you’re working on, on quicksand, basically, you know, it’s not gonna be permanent, it’s not really going to support any kind of pressure or pushing or anything, it’s going to fall apart.

Jason Cutter
Yeah, and one of the biggest things, too, that I address in in the book is understanding why you’re in sales. And the top line answer that most people say is for the money, right? I’m in it for the money, of course. But why are you in it for the money? Like, what’s the money mean to you, because it always means something, right? Even if it’s an I had a salesperson that I worked with, where her goal was to have money in the bank, but I was like, why? And she said, well, because she moved here from another country, or, and they had no money, and she wants to have money so that if anyone in her family ever needs help, she’s the go to, and she can help them out. Right? So, for actually the money, but the money is attached to a much bigger meaning. And it’s so emotional, even as I think about it, I might I get goosebumps thinking about her telling me that story. And so, one of the things that I help people understand is, why are you in sales? Why do you want to make the money at the deepest level possible, just keep digging, like you would do with one of your clients, and then take that and put that on a vision board or something as a visual reminder, because here’s what you and I both know, sales is hard? If you’re amazing, you might be closing three out of 10 opportunities, depending on your lifecycle, like the sales cycle, and, and the lead flow, which means you’re losing 70% of the time. So, you have to remember why you’re doing it. So, you can pick yourself up after falling down over and over again. Because that’s what it takes. Even if you’re amazing. And you’re winning, you’re still having to pick yourself up a bunch.

Christopher Smith
Yeah. And I’ve talked about this a lot in the podcast with sales leaders that if you don’t have a compelling reason as to why you’re doing what you’re doing, that isn’t just money, it can’t be about money, it has to go deeper, you’re not going to make it you’re not going to survive long term through the grind that selling is how do you get people to shift per sec perspective, if necessary to begin building that foundation of authenticity?

Jason Cutter
You know, it’s a couple of things one is that why is super important. The second one is what their strengths are, what are they bringing to the table again, I am a naturally analytical problem-solving person. So, what are my strengths and then owning that and realizing that okay, and that who you are is the important part. And the other thing for the authenticity is understanding there is no natural born salesperson. And I will argue that for a very long time. There’re people who see someone that there’s natural born salesperson, right sell ice to Eskimos, which I think is the worst thing you could ever do, because that’s just the sign of a terrible intent for a salesperson, right, sell something to somebody that they don’t need. I think I think there’s some attributes that help in a sales environment, extrovert, charismatic, storytelling, all those things might help, doesn’t appeal to everybody. And normally what it is, is it’s more than that person has been that way and honing that since they were probably a kid and schmoozing their way through things since they were a kid. And they’ve just parlayed that into the right career. Right, which is the opposite of me. And so, a lot of people think they have to be this way. And I feel and there’s five traits that I show people that are actually more important for success in sales or any profession. And as long as you have those or you’re willing to work on those, you bring you to the table, and you will be amazing. And your customers will appreciate it.

Christopher Smith
Can we talk about two of those traits, too, that you think are really important?

Jason Cutter
Yeah, and I’m glad you asked. Because there, I’ll talk about the first two in the priorities, and leave out the other ones that everyone always thinks of as the important ones. And the important ones being like persistence, grit, stuff like that, I think those are good. But if you’re misguided and go in the wrong direction, you can be as persistent ingredients you want. And it’s terrible for you or for everyone else. The top two on my list of five is openness, and curiosity. And again, that might seem weird that I’m saying to be an amazing, effective selling professional. Number one is openness. Number two is curiosity. But it’s so true. And it’s so important above everything else. The reason why I say that is I have seen so many veteran salespeople who have been in the business for a long time, and then they’re trying to get a new job. And then you hire them into a new role at a new job. And they’re bringing all this experience, and they literally are closed minded, they want to do it the way they’ve always done it. And they don’t want to follow your process or do it a certain way, they just want to do it their way. And that never works out. So somebody who’s open to feedback to ideas to, hey, here’s this new scripting, or here’s a new way to say this, we want you to try this, because we know it’s going to work, somebody who’s open to that is going to do well, once they’re open, Curiosity is so important, not just about their product, the service the industry, like being a student of all that curious of that prospect they’re talking to, because a lot of people are in sales, they think that what they have is the best thing ever, and everyone should just want it. And they don’t actually care about other people and what makes them tick and how to help that individual, which we can talk about on more tangents here. But they’re not curious about people, they don’t care, they don’t ask questions, and then their efforts will fall really flat on a lot of people.

Christopher Smith
It’s really interesting that, you know, openness and curiosity that I’m thinking about did to truly be curious, authentically curious, you have to be open, you can’t do it without that being, you know, being able to be open and in, you know, they go hand in hand. Do you agree with that?

Jason Cutter
I do. And that’s why I put in that order. I mean, you only asked for two. So I want to talk about the other ones by the, by the book for the rest, it’s in there, it’s important to look at. But the key is, is it’s in that order as well. Because again, exactly what you’re saying is like you can be super curious. But if you’re not open, you’re gonna learn all kinds of stuff that you don’t really take in or care about or use for the right reasons, right? Because I see a lot of curious salespeople who act curious, and they want to learn some things so they can use it. And then it’s more manipulation and persuasion. And then again, that’s, that’s what people like you and I are trying to change about sales in general and get rid of,

Christopher Smith
And I’ve been on those sales calls where, you know, I’ve been the recipient where people are asking me questions, and I can tell you don’t give a shit what I’m gonna say on offer my answer, you’re just asking this because this question number three of seven, you have to ask me?

Jason Cutter
Yep. They know that they’re supposed to ask questions. They know that if I ask you questions, it’ll seem like I care. I want to get through this. Let me just go through it. It doesn’t matter what you say. Because again, I think I am amazing. I think my product is amazing. And I’m going to sell it to you whether I know about you or not, I don’t need to know about you. Everyone wins, right? It’s the everyone wins sales strategy, which is gross, unless you’re selling like magazines or you know, some commodity. Otherwise, you need to know. And the other part that’s also doesn’t work, especially from a customer standpoint, is where you can tell that salesperson is asking all kinds of questions. And what they’re looking for is the ammunition they need to manipulate you into buying, and either corner you or trick you. And that’s what leads a lot of order taking salespeople to be afraid of asking questions, because they’re afraid of doing that to other people, or having people push back and say, why are you asking me all these questions? You’re just trying to use this against me. And so that leads the right people to not ask enough questions, either. That’s right.

Christopher Smith
And I think that if you if you don’t have that openness, you don’t have the ability to sit there and truly evaluate who you’re talking to, to say what is the best way I can help this person? You’re going to be rigid and follow your path, whatever it is that your perspective you’re coming from. You don’t have that ability to put yourself truly in the shoes of your customer. How do you how do you help people when it’s Trouble with openness? How do you help bring that out and get them to that place of openness?

Jason Cutter
So that’s a really tough one. And I’ve never had anyone asked me that question before, my semi smart answer is, well, they have to be open so that I can then teach them how to be open. Which then it’s like this catch 22. Because if they’re not open to being open, then I’m never going to help them. That’s one of those things. And that’s where it’s the primary step. Really, they have to be bringing that with them, they can always be more open, and really being more open is feeding into the curiosity being more open in the business sense, which is, hey, I listened to your call, here’s some things you could say better. That comes that openness in that category, right? Because it’s all inclusive, is where they have to feel like it’s safe. People are trying to help them. And they have to get their ego out of the way, the biggest thing that keeps people from being open is the ego is in the way saying it’s safer in my bubble, I don’t need to know anything else, because outside is danger and might make me feel bad about myself for all these evolutionary biological, psychological reasons we could get into, and I don’t want to learn anything. So, for me, what I found is, and this is why this is number one on the list, the openness is that you hire somebody who’s either open, or they’re not. And if they’re not open, it’s up to them. But if they’re not going to be open, I mean, and I’ve learned how to filter those people out in the recruiting process, or because I can teach somebody everything else, as long as they’re open and curious. Curious, we can take care of the rest.

Christopher Smith
Yeah. But I, I agree with what you’re saying that I’ve learned that they’re just people, they’re just rigid. They’re set in their ways. They’re not willing to adapt. That to me, I don’t know how you function. And he’s successful if you don’t possess the trait of openness these days?

Jason Cutter
Yeah, yeah. I mean, having a fixed mindset where you’re not open and, and hey, there’s, if we look at our lives, and I speak about myself, there’s areas for myself and for others, where I’m very rigid or fixed in this one category, right? My beliefs or my thoughts and my ideas around this. And then there’s others where we’re more open, same thing where people are open to change in some areas and trying things that are new, and then others, like literally, I’m not going to change that thing, right? I may try a new restaurant; I’m never moving out of this town. Right? And so, I think it’s about are they open? Can they be open in terms of this? And if they’re so rigid, and their mindset is fixed, same thing with selling, and this is the dangerous balance when trying to coach someone, especially if they’re in sales as an order taker, is that that same thing is true? If they’re a prospective client, if that lead that prospect is so close minded, then you’re not going to change their mind. Right? It’s not going to work. However, if you’re weak in sales, and you’re not able to detect that, you might give up too early using that as the logic all the time, which is, oh, well, they are have a closed mind, and they’re not open to it. So, I’m not going to try, right, there’s trying with someone that could be on the fence, and then there’s, you know, just not doing it. So, I think that’s also important too is the longer you’re in sales, the more you realize, if somebody is really close minded about your idea, your product, your service, just move on 7 billion people on the planet.

Christopher Smith
What was the hardest thing about writing this book?

Jason Cutter
Oh, honestly, the hardest part was the imposter syndrome, and the doubts every single moment of every single day, probably. Honestly, it was it was so tough. In fact, I wrote the book without a title. I didn’t have the title until I was literally done with, I was moving through most of the edits, the second time writing the book, which I’ll talk about that in a second. And I was I remember one morning, I was listening to a podcast, and the guest on the podcast was like, here’s my eight steps for doing this. And I’m like, I have no steps. I have no framework. Like I have a philosophy but and I just felt like the biggest impostor, and I was like, What the hell am I doing? I feel like such a phony which most people do. Whether they admit it or not, like it’s just that part of our brain, even if we’re amazing. Oh, yeah, well think we’re amazing. Our brain is just, it’s just a liar. And it’s so mean. And so literally, I got home, it was like 630 in the morning, I sat down in the corner of the living room. So, I’m like, I’m just gonna sit here. I’m not getting up until I have a title for this book. And I figure out what the hell I’m doing. And then that’s when I came up with authentic persuasion and whatnot. The second hardest thing about writing the book was the fact that I wrote it. And I’m a really fast writer, and it was really easy to write that process was amazingly quick, but I wrote it and I read it and I was like, this is garbage. And I threw it away and rewrote it again. And we’re talking 60,000 words. So, I wrote, I threw it away, and then wrote it a second time from scratch. And then we really edited. Luckily, my editor is amazing and makes me sound really smart. In the written word, clean up my, my grammar. But yeah, that was that was hard as well reading it. And also knowing is this bad because of imposter syndrome? Or is this bad because it’s just boring, and there’s nothing to it. And I’m so glad I rewrote it. Um, so

Christopher Smith
It to me, just, I know, you said earlier that some people don’t like the title, or maybe you react in the wrong way to the title. But to me, the title completely resonated. Because I’m a huge believer in authenticity, that you’ve got to start there. And you have to be willing to talk yourself out of a deal to say, hey, look, this isn’t the right fit. You know, we’re not the right match here. There’s probably a better one for you. And I wish you the best of luck. And see you later.

Jason Cutter
Yeah, I actually have a chapter in the book called The power of saying no, which is the power for both them as the customer and doing what’s right. Obviously, that’s easiest to understand. But then also the power internal to you, which is the power you get from telling the wrong people No, and how much power that gives you when you tell the right people? Yes. Then you mean it, then you know, there’s a difference in you versus others, because it’s not about the money? Because you would tell people No. And I’ve told that I’ve had prospective clients who say, Well, you’re just telling me this, because you want me to buy from, you know, if you were not the right fit? I would tell you no, in fact, last week, I told somebody No. And here’s why. I’m telling you yes. Because we both know you need this. Right. Right. And that’s different. And that’s powerful. And most people don’t embrace that, because they’re coming from more scarcity than abundance. Right? Versus if it’s a good fit, I’m going to help you. But if it’s not, I’m going to help you some other way.

Christopher Smith
Exactly, exactly. I’m a big believer in that. And I’ve done that before, to where I’d like, just early on, I can just tell that this is not we’re not aligned, you know, and that’s okay. We don’t have to always be aligned with people, you know, they have different needs than what I can provide. And, you know, so, you know, I’m helping them by saying, you know, we’re not the right fit, as opposed to trying to scram that square peg in the round hole, which really doesn’t serve anyone.

Jason Cutter
No, it doesn’t. And short term, it seems good long term in one workout, because they’re gonna realize it when they wake up, the next day, and buyer’s remorse kicks in and they cancel or return it. It’s always going to be bad long term. It feels good short term, but you know, it’s not good. Can I share something else? Please? I guess, you know, in case they don’t get the book, but something from that chapter that I think is really helpful in this conversation, too. Yeah, oh, please. So, the other thing with the power of saying no, and where that’s really valuable, and I help a lot of salespeople understand this and leverage it actually leverage it for their gain, which stay with me. And I know this might sound weird, but like I’m going somewhere with this is that when like that example, where you told somebody know, the square peg problem, I got a round hole solution. It’s just not a good fit, I can’t help you. In that moment, you did something that professionals do that what they were worried about was what a salesperson wouldn’t do. Because when we talked about sales in the dirty sense, salesperson is looking out for their own motivation. They want to manipulate they want to get it done. They want to close the deal for their own sake. They don’t always care what happens to the other person, the moment you cross that line into the professional mode and tell the wrong people. No, that non client now says, holy crap. I thought this person was going to sell me. I just assumed like I was in for a fight. They literally told me no. And once the shock wears off, because they’re surprised, they realize, Wait, that’s not what salespeople do. This person is different. Because they told me no, I actually trust them more. And I appreciate them. I’ve had clients like begged me No, please let me sign up after I’ve said no, and I’m not a tactic. I’m not doing the takeaway, right? I’m not playing hard to get like, I mean, it you don’t. But what’s interesting is that if you’re a professional and you play the long game, those people you tell no to will generally become amazing referral sources for you. Because now they will tell their friends or coworkers or businesses that could use you. And that is so powerful, because again, imagine if you go to a mechanic and you have a check engine light and the mechanic looks at your car and says, oh, there was just this one switch. I hit this I reset it for you. I’m not charging anything. That’s not what you were expecting. You’re expecting a big fat bill. And then to take advantage of you. And so, when you don’t get that when you get a good experience, what are you going to do now, if anyone ever asked for a mechanic, Oh, that’s

Christopher Smith
Such a great analogy. I had that experience where, you know, I had a problem with my car and a guy I was working with, say, take it to the shop. I know it’s not close to where you live, but it is worth the drive. They’re the most honest mechanics around. It was the same kind of thing. I went in there. And they were like, you know, like, yeah, they took a look. And they’re like, here we go. It was like $20, or some nominal amount. And I’m like, you gotta be kidding me. What? It’s not $400 or 600, or whatever. And they’re like, no, no, it was a piece of cake. We did this, boom, you’re out. And I’m like, who are these guys. And I’ve referred so much business to them, everybody I knew I’m like, don’t waste your time going anywhere else. But these guys. And it’s so true, which is said that that power of just a simple like forgoing that short term gain, you can get a much longer term when?

Jason Cutter
Well, and here’s that. And that’s a great story. I have one I talked about in the book about my parents when they had someone come to help them fix their dishwasher. Here’s the challenge, though. And this is what I see in the real-world applications. People are listening to this going, okay, guys, that sounds great. But like, seriously, because here’s the thing that I see is a lot of people are in sales, and they don’t know how long they’re going to stay in there. Now, if we’re talking about sales professionals who are in it for the career in the long term, that’s a different group. But a lot of people either don’t know if they’re going to be in sales, because it’s so rough for them now, and they’re not winning, and it’s up and down, and they’re not succeeding, or they don’t even know if they’re gonna stay at the same company. More than six months, if you’ve been in any sales organization for six months, you’ve seen so much turnover, that you no longer have faith in yourself to stay in that place, whether it’s your fault, or the company’s fault. And so, a lot of people then default to short term, they’re not planting seeds, like a farmer for referrals they might get next year, because they don’t know if they’re going to be alive next year, right, and their sales career. And so, then they go to short term thinking, and then they’re just in this cycle. And it’s just not effective. You have to like; I have a chapter in there called act like a hunter think like a farmer. So, you have to eat today. But you’ve also got to plant the right seeds long term. That’s right and play the long game.

Christopher Smith
That’s right, you know, I could play your game. And I don’t want to come across like this altruistic thing that I’ll turn away every deal. No, no, no, it’s not that at all. But it’s got to be the right fit, you know, and it’s like the goal, the outcome has to be assured. And again, it’s coming back from that, that foundation of authenticity that I know, I truly believe I can help my customers. And if I can’t, then I’m gonna tell them. Yeah, plain, and simple. So, if there was one thing you wanted me to take away from your book, what is that one thing?

Jason Cutter
You know, I think the biggest thing, and this shifts both the authenticity piece that we were talking about early on, and the persuasion piece, which is the selling aspect, right, the sales process piece is that sales is service. Most people think sales is dirty, and sales, is manipulation, or sales is something I’m doing to you. When you take a step back, and you see what sales really could be and should be the act of selling is the act of doing a service for somebody else, which is what we’re talking about. And we’re not talking about tourists there. I’m talking, you make as much money as you possibly can, serving people and bringing value and solving problems and helping the right people, there’s more than enough like this is that’s what we’re talking about. The difference is, is that when you see sales is service, and you see that your job as a sales professional is to do something for your clients and with your clients not to them, then it changes both your mindset and what you think your role is. And it also changes the conversation because now it’s a team event. It’s you and me versus your problems. It’s you and me to go to your goals instead of you versus me and your wallet. And that’s a huge shift.

Christopher Smith
That’s a huge So, Jason, we’re coming up on our time here on sales lead dog. If people want to reach out connect with you, they want to find out more about the cutter Consulting Group, what’s the best way for them to do that?

Jason Cutter
So, if you want to know about the book, the podcast, any of that the consulting simplest place is Jason cutter.com. So that’s a hub for all of those things. If you want to buy the book directly, I’ll send you an autographed copy. I also do book clubs for organizations that buy them for everybody, and we do some coaching training packages. The consulting is in there the podcast. So, Jason cutter.com Anyone wants to email me It’s Jason at cutter consulting group.com And last I checked, I’m still the number one ranked Jason cutter on Google. So, when in doubt, just google me, I’ve got my SEO going pretty good for the first, I don’t know, three and a half pages. So, you can find some pretty cool.

Christopher Smith
And we’ll have all that in the show notes too. In case you missed any of that, check out the show notes. Be sure to get the book selling with authentic persuasion. Jason, thank you for coming on sales lead on,

Jason Cutter
Chris. Thanks for having me. This was a blast. And I am sure we could have made this a very, very long episode talking about all kinds of sales stuff, so I appreciate it.

Christopher Smith
Yeah, I wish the statistics that listings that supported a longer session because this is a definitely, we could have gone a long time.

Jason Cutter
Well, we’ll have to do a part to you then.

Christopher Smith
That sounds great. I love that.

Outro
As we end this discussion on Sales Lead Dog, be sure to subscribe to catch all our episodes on social media. Follow us on LinkedIn, Facebook, and Instagram. Watch the videos on YouTube. And you can also find our episodes on our website at empellorcrm.com/salesleaddog. Sales Lead Dog is supported by Empellor CRM, delivering objectively better CRM for business guaranteed.

 

Quotes

• “It was born out of about 16 years of experience inside a telephone sales room, running both sales and the lead gen side for call centers, mostly business to consumer.” (1:04-1:18)
• “It’s building a system and process that you can repeat, almost like a franchise, no matter how many offices no matter how many reps.” (1:31-1:37)
• “I love teaching, I love that light bulb moment that people have when you teach them something, and they use it.” (6:34-6:40)
• “For me, it’s both of those parts of the formula, authentic, and persuasion, are what’s required to be an effective sales professional.” (7:59-8:08)
• “The persuasion piece is the active pursuit of helping the right people across the finish line and leaving them in a better place.” (10:33-10:41)

Links

Jason Cutter: LinkedIn
Cutter Consulting Group: LinkedIn
Cutter Consulting Group Website

Empellor CRM LinkedIn
Empellor CRM Website
Empellor CRM Twitter