0:00
What advice do you have for someone who’s considering a transition into a leadership role?
0:06
Look, I, I think you have to ask yourself, what are you in it for?
0:10
A lot of people think that leadership role is, is the next step in evolution.
0:16
But if you’re in it for only your own personal benefits, it might not be the best role.
0:21
I think a leadership role is really somebody who’s going to be OK not being the one that’s going to shine.
0:28
To me, the leadership role is the guy who’s sometimes clearing the land mines, removing the obstacles to somebody else can shine.
0:35
It’s about helping others develop and be be greater than what they thought they could be.
0:43
And on the positive side of like, if you’re one of those people that spots talent that you see something that somebody’s not achieving, but you see that talent in them and all you got to do is help pull it out and you’re willing to do that over and over and over.
0:56
I’m going to go back to the repetition.
0:58
The power and repetition is not just for sales, it’s also for sales leaders.
1:01
We have to stay in it and we have to stay true to do the boring work and help others shine and help others excel, exceed the goals that were put in front of them.
1:13
That would be the advice I would give them.
1:19
What’s the story of vulnerability you share with your young leaders that you’re trying to develop, you know, lessons learned that you’ve, you’ve, you talked about some here, but what’s the one you share?
1:31
So look, I don’t know if there’s one that I constantly share, but I, but I, I am open to sharing like some of the deals that I’ve lost, right?
1:41
And not because the company failed, but because I failed.
1:45
And to me, the one those deals that I lost early on in my career, they all boiled down to one thing.
1:50
I didn’t stay in the fight long enough.
1:52
I thought it was lost before it really was lost.
1:55
And then when all the cards end up unfolding and like the conversations come out, it’s like, wait, so all I do would has to stay in it a little bit longer and I would have had a fighting chance to get it.
2:05
And nine times out of 10, those were the the reasons, right?
2:08
It’s like we’re very quick to say cup bait, right?
2:11
As opposed to let me stay in this a little bit longer.
2:14
Let me figure out what I need to do.
2:17
And when you see that somebody else was willing to do that, that’s when the pain sets in.
2:21
Somebody else is willing to stay in this longer than I was.
2:25
And you share that with with with younger sales reps.
2:29
Let’s make sure that we’re not cutting bait too soon.
2:33
Have we exhausted all of our options?
2:35
Look, we’ve already invested all this time and energy and we’ve built this relationship.
2:39
How can we stay in it a little bit longer?
2:49
That’s, I tell you, that’s something I just had that phone call today over lunch, you know, talking to a prospect where, you know, they wanted huge.
2:59
So we scoped out huge for them and they were like, wow, that’s expensive.
3:05
OK.
3:06
And so then their executives like, I’m not even sure we’re going to move forward with this because we weren’t expecting that price tag.
3:12
OK, well, how about we do this tiny little thing right here to help you over this little hurdle that you have?
3:21
Because I know once we, if we get our foot in the door and advise your role, whatever it is, where we’re truly helping them and guiding them, we’ll be fine.
3:29
You know, So it’s like, how do I what the, what windows open, what doors open?
3:33
Where can I find some way to get in and start building that relationship that that’s such an accurate description of sales.
3:41
It’s not about the, it’s not about the home run.
3:44
Yeah, it’s about let’s, let’s start getting some base hits, let’s bump my way on to 1st, but let’s get a win under our belt.
3:52
And again, like, I think some of us just stay in it for that huge home run and you end up leaving flustered and somebody else got a couple base hits and, and all of a sudden like they’re they’re getting the the guy home and it’s like, yeah, I mean, that’s painful, right?
4:05
Oh yeah.
4:05
Like I, I’m not looking for customers for the next 6 months.
4:09
I’m on them for the next 6-8 ten years.
4:12
I’m with you, you know, and it’s like, Nah, I don’t to me, that’s like you got to play the long game.
4:19
It is.
4:20
And sometimes that’s easy to forget, right?
4:22
Sometimes, like and and and we all fall in love when there is that, you know, they ask you for that huge proposal.
4:26
They want to go huge and you fall in love with the with the potential of that huge deal.
4:32
And then we’d be we put these blinders on and it’s all about the huge deal.
4:36
And you might end up losing out on that huge deal and somebody might end up landing that huge deal by landing a couple small deals along the way.
4:43
That’s right.
4:43
That’s right.
4:44
So, yeah, it’s, it’s, it’s, it’s powerful, right?
4:47
Yeah, yeah, no, it’s like it, it’s all about you got to just figure out, just got to get your foot in the door, you know, and, and just go from there.
4:55
I agree.
4:56
Sometimes you’re going in through the front door or the loading dock is a baby if it’s a really big one, you know, but sometimes you’re climbing through a second story window, you know, Well, I mean it, it kind of sounds like, you know, our business.
5:10
Well, we go through a lot of loading docks physically and, and a lot of appointments in in our world happen, you know, in stock rooms and in warehouses and they lead you into the C-Suite.
5:22
But those you, you, you got to get in somewhere.
5:24
And sometimes you’re helping somebody on in the back of the house getting a victory in, and it turns out that they have direct communication with the CEO who is looking for a much bigger solution.
5:34
But you were able to resolve a couple of their problems.
5:36
So I mean, like you asked me early in our conversation, what are the foundations?
5:41
And it’s like when you’re looking to help and you’re genuinely looking to help, even if you find one of those small solutions and you’re genuinely looking to help, that’s going to lead you to a bigger one just because.
5:52
Yeah.
5:52
Oh, yeah.
5:58
What was that first job like?
6:01
It was it was trials and tribulations.
6:05
It taught me resilience.
6:08
It was a lot of door knocking.
6:10
It was a lot of rejection.
6:12
It was a lot of not knowing how to deal with rejection, but realizing very quickly in my career that the sooner I forgot about that rejection, the sooner my real personality would come back out and I would be able to start another genuine conversation.
6:24
And I think that that was is what taught me the most from from that first sales job is get over your losses quickly and move on to the next one and let yourself come out.
6:33
Yeah.
6:34
You know, one of my best friends started his sales career that way, selling copiers.
6:39
Literally, he would just go into a high rise downtown and just start working.
6:44
He learned that to evade security, he had to start at the top and work his way down, skip floors every once in a while, then loop back up to stay ahead of security.
6:54
But he’s like, it was nothing but rejection.
6:57
And so he learned how to hustle, you know, and, and like you just got to you just got it.
7:02
Like you said, shed the rejection, keep hustling first.
7:05
That was my first job when I got to South Florida, which was my second sales job was selling copiers and how I ended up meeting the CEO of World Emblem and I did the same thing.
7:16
It was, I used to take pride in wearing out my shoes like I, I got to go buy shoes.
7:21
Well, what ’cause you know, I, I just went and knocked on 200 doors this week and the, the high rise analogy is perfect.
7:27
I wish I learned that one sooner of learning to skip floors cause security would come looking for you.
7:32
Are you soliciting?
7:33
Well, no, I’m actually not soliciting.
7:34
I’m just here to drop off a business card to meet somebody.
7:37
But different interpretations for different people.
7:40
And some of it saw it as as soliciting.
7:42
Yeah.
7:43
But it’s all about the hustle, right?
7:45
You know, you just it that’s you.
7:47
You just got to look for that next opportunity.
7:49
It’s right around the corner, next door down the hall.
7:52
It is, man.
7:53
You’re you’re you’re always one.
7:54
No, away from your next.
7:56
Yes.
8:01
So when you’re starting your career and you’re trying to figure out, hey, what am I going to do for the rest of my life?
8:06
Were you envisioning a career in sales or did you have a different path in mind?
8:11
No.
8:11
Look, I think sales to me really came by chance.
8:15
Somebody recently asked me if I knew that I was meant to be a salesperson.
8:20
I don’t think I knew that I was meant to be a salesperson.
8:22
I just knew who I wasn’t meant to be.
8:24
And that was my parents really.
8:26
They had their heart set on me being a lawyer.
8:29
I’ve proven to be an argumentative, argumentative child, and they thought that they could turn that into into a lawyer.
8:36
But I knew that I was not destined to stay in school for another four years past college.
8:43
So sales came to me at by chance, you know, they were pushing for law school.
8:47
I knew I did not want to go back to school.
8:50
And people started making observations of how I was always naturally curious and always trying to connect people.
8:56
And somebody said, well, why don’t you stop connecting people and connect people to solutions, which I had no clue what that meant.
9:02
And then they made a recommendation for a sales job.
9:04
I went on an interview, got a sales job, and 20 some years later, it’s been a it’s been a a phenomenal career.
9:13
That’s awesome.
9:17
Do you have a background in sports, Man?
9:20
I played every sport known to man was mediocre at all of them.
9:25
But I showed up with passion.
9:27
I wanted, I wanted to be the star, but I just didn’t have the left and right foot or coordination.
9:34
But the heart was there.
9:35
Yeah.
9:35
So how’s that influenced?
9:37
You know how you function as a sales leader.
9:40
Look, to me, sports is a big part of leadership in general.
9:44
And I think sales just plays very hand in hand with with with with sports.
9:50
We have numbers to hit.
9:51
They have a scoreboard.
9:53
And to me, like the way that I tie it back, we have to be playing the game.
9:56
But at the end of the day, we’re not playing it for fun.
9:58
We’re playing this to win.
9:59
And there’s only one way to measure them.
10:01
If we’re winning or losing, it’s the scoreboard.
10:04
So we always tie things back.
10:05
Like we talk about KPIs and we talk about the end of month.
10:09
Well, that’s easy.
10:10
Where’s the scoreboard?
10:11
If you put up a scoreboard, I think it brings out the best in people.
10:15
Nobody wants to play for a tie.
10:17
Nobody definitely does not want to play to lose.
10:20
And if you want to play to win, then I want you on my team.
