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Welcome to the Sales Lead Dog podcast hosted by CRM technology and sales process expert Christopher Smith.
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Talking with sales leaders that have separated themselves from the rest of the pack.
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Listen to find out how the best of the best achieved success with their team and CRM technology.
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And remember, unless you were the lead dog, the view never changes.
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Welcome to Sales Lead Dog.
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On today’s episode, I have joining me Kevin Corbett.
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Kevin is the Managing Director of I got to pull up his title here, managing director, corporate Development and Strategy.
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It’s a great title.
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Kevin.
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Welcome to sales lead Dawn.
0:43
Thanks, Chris.
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Appreciate you having me on today.
0:45
So Kevin, you’re with Mariner.
0:47
Tell me a bit about Mariner.
0:49
Sure, happy to.
0:50
Mariner Wealth Advisors is one of our nation’s largest independent fee based Rias that’s a registered investment advisor that is a wealth management entity that directly serves the needs of clients and institutions around the country mentioned we’re one of the largest.
1:04
We’re a firm that was started by advisors and continue to grow our business both organically as well as inorganically.
1:12
The bulk of my time and my role on on managing Director of Corporate Development and strategy is, is helping assess inorganic or M&A acquisition opportunities that we contemplate and and and do throughout the year.
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The firm operates across a footprint of 41 states, currently about 116 offices and we’ve got over 800 advisors directly servicing the needs of our end clients.
1:36
And we built a number of unique wealth management capabilities to directly address the wealth planning needs of, of our clients across a wide spectrum of, of client sizes and, and attributes and investment styles, you name it.
1:50
Yeah, that’s awesome.
1:51
So who are your primary customers?
1:53
Who are you guys targeting when you’re going out and trying to grow the business?
1:58
Yeah, Chris.
1:58
So our, our primary customer is, is, you know, affluent high net worth to ultra high net worth individuals at the firm level.
2:06
Again, in my role, very, very unique skill set and focus on just looking at in advisors that may join our business as well as teams of advisors or the potential acquisition of a firm’s ownership interest to acquire the entire, you know, firm that includes the talent, the clients they serve and and continue to grow from that standpoint.
2:28
Yeah, that’s awesome.
2:32
When I’m just going to go jump right in here.
2:34
Kevin, when you look back over your career, what are the three things that have really driven and LED your success?
2:42
I think it, you know, wow, three things.
2:46
So number one, I think attention to detail.
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I think I’m somebody that’s always had a very, very high level, often times described as a control freak.
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Want to know everything, want to understand things.
2:57
And it, it is equipped me to be hopefully much, much better than my peers in the job that I do.
3:04
I think that that covers everything from researching prospective firms that we may acquire, learning as much as possible so that the nature of the conversations that we have are very in depth and very additive to what they’re trying to accomplish versus where we may or may not be a fit.
3:22
Secondarily, I think, you know, honesty and integrity are something that are kind of hallmarks of the way that I’ve operated in in my career.
3:29
And so while, you know, financial services sales is, is maybe, you know, one of those, those areas where people feel, you know, maybe a little less confident about who they engage with.
3:40
I’m very specific about, you know, what I talk to people about in in a world where they are potentially selling their lives work to to us here at Mariner.
3:51
And and that creates a very intimate exchange of of ideas and opportunities and conversations.
3:58
Probably less salesy, more psychiatrist sometimes getting somebody to kind of embrace that, you know, going from an entrepreneur to an employee.
4:07
What does that mean for them?
4:08
And so I spent a lot of time on that point.
4:10
And so I think that the sensitivity to their personal situation, what’s important to them, what’s important to the constituents that they serve, and having that understanding of what that mental leap really involves is crucial to my success.
4:26
I think, you know, third is, look, while, while most people in sales have an individual contributor type of a title or role and, and maybe perhaps a mindset, I couldn’t do what I do or be successful in, in my endeavours without the support of my team.
4:43
And I think learning that very early on that, you know, it takes a village, right?
4:46
It’s not just one individual that’s successful in, in closing business.
4:52
That’s part of it, but there’s so much more to it.
4:55
And, and to know that I’m supported by a team that’s going to continue, continue to engage with me, to check in from time to time.
5:02
And I also have the ability to, you know, check in with them on the progress of a potential deal that’s in process.
5:08
Just to have that really wonderful exchange of ideas and, and working relationship really has been paramount to the success that I’ve had in this role.
5:17
So I think you may have answered one of the questions a listener of this episode might have is like, why are you having Kevin on his corporate development and strategy?
5:26
He’s not a sales leader, but you just talked about you are selling in your role.
5:33
When you’re going out and having these conversations with the entrepreneurs that have these firms, it, it’s their baby you’re talking to them about.
5:42
There’s a deep emotional connection most entrepreneurs have to their business and you’re asking them to give up control, ownership, whatever you want to talk to.
5:53
They feel about the same way they do their kids.
5:56
That’s a pretty heavy discussion.
5:59
And so it’s it’s selling in part psychology.
6:05
How you know, when you look back over your career, what did you learn early on in your early roles selling that are helping you today?
6:16
I think, Chris, you’re, you’re absolutely right and you’re spot on about everything you just described about an, an entrepreneur.
6:21
This is their life’s work.
6:22
This is often times their most single concentrated asset that they own.
6:26
And they have to plan accordingly for what the next phase of their business looks like.
6:30
And so while they may try to sell me on the virtues of their firm and their team, the client base they serve, that’s all very important.
6:38
But likewise, I’m selling them on what they’re ultimately trying to accomplish and where we may or may not be a good partner for their business.
6:46
OK.
6:47
My job is to assess the cultural components and the fit of somebody who’s looking to potentially partner with Mariner and, and really spend a lot of time engaging from that standpoint.
6:57
To the extent that for whatever reason, it is not a fit, I’m the first to walk away.
7:03
And so I think confidence in knowing what’s a good fit and what’s not a good fit is crucial to where you want to spend your time, effort, and energy.
7:13
I think the other thing too, that I learned early on is that ultimately people aren’t buying products or services.
7:19
Often times they’re buying the people who represent that company, organization or solution.
7:24
And if they have trust and confidence in the individual, they’re going to be probably one of your best customers because to the extent that something goes wrong or something is disruptive downstream, they’re going to want to know that when they pick up the phone and call Kevin, they’re going to get the answer they need.
7:40
They’re going to get the help that they need.
7:42
And it’s not going to be something where it’s a sorry, turn it over to a large organization.
7:46
We no longer have that one-on-one relationship.
7:49
And I think that’s generally the way with the last 29 years that I’ve been in this business, have conducted myself.
7:55
And, and really, I think realize some level of success as a result of, of really focusing on the people, the relationships and making sure that ultimately I’m hearing what they’re looking for and trying to solve for and either addressing it or, or candidly telling them when we may not be a fit.
8:11
May you sum doubt to me what a good salesperson is.
8:14
That was awesome because it is it’s you have to be willing to walk away if it’s not a win for both sides.
8:22
And that’s hard for a lot of sales people to learn that lesson, especially early in their career.
8:26
Not every deal’s a good deal, you know, if ultimately it’s going to end up with a dissatisfied customer, a bad review, a bad reference, who’s that a win for, you know?
8:38
Yeah, Chris, it’s funny.
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I spent the 1st 17 years, So I’ve been at Mariner for 10 years now.
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Spent the 1st 17 plus years of my career at Fidelity Investments, one of the nation’s largest financial institutions.
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And when I met my wife 13 years ago, and she to this day probably couldn’t describe what it is I did at Fidelity or, or, or in a very concise way what I do at Mariner today.
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You know, she was very perceptive to say your clients don’t work with Fidelity.
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And whether there’s an issue, they don’t talk to Fidelity.
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They call you.
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They need you to get involved and to, to be an advocate for them and to solve it or to help them address whatever it is.
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And, and that really I thought was insightful from somebody with 0, you know, sales experience and, and zero financial services experience to, to quickly key in on it’s the nature of the relationships.
9:29
And so I thought that was something that even though maybe I kind of had that in the back of my mind for some time for somebody like that to point that out and, and really spell it out that clearly it, that was pretty eye opening for me.
9:41
Isn’t that funny how that comes out of left field like that?
9:43
You’re like, I’ve been, I do this for a living, and I probably couldn’t have said it better than someone from the outside that just says, hey, this is who you are.
9:53
This is what you do.
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And you’re like, you’re right.
9:56
That is you said that better than I could.
9:58
You know, it always blows my mind when that happens.
10:02
Yeah, that’s awesome.
10:03
So I imagine you didn’t start out your career wanting to have the role you have today.
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What was your early vision for how you thought your career would, you know what direction you would go with a career when you were getting started?
10:19
Yeah, Chris, look, 29 years later, I, I tell people I still don’t know what I want to be when I grow up, right.
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But I, I found myself in a very unique niche in a, in a very unique and specialized role in a very large industry that has rewarded me both personally and professionally.
10:34
And so, you know, again, back in 1995 when I started with Fidelity Investments, I was answering phone calls doing essentially what the Internet does today for most investors, which is to provide quotes and balances, right?
10:47
That’s literally how archaic times were back in the early to mid 90s, OK, As I continue to learn more and more about the business had an appeal towards really working with the institutions, the, the professional, you know, money managers and advisors to a larger swath of retail clients.
11:06
And so back in 2003, I was offered a unique opportunity to, to come down to North Texas, where I’ve lived and worked and made my home for the last 21 years, to join Fidelity Institutional and to go out and, and work with and sell directly to institutions and to advisors that were looking to leave a captive environment, typically a wire house where they work and go and set up their own individual RAA shop.
11:31
And so again, you know, taking them through that process of how Fidelity and how me personally and individually would help support them in that endeavour and, and line up the resources of our team to help them achieve that success and achieve that next level of, you know, their own opportunity set with by building their own business, building their own enterprise value was pretty rewarding.
11:53
Kind of bringing it full circle.
11:54
You know, 18 years ago, had the opportunity to meet a gentleman named Marty Bicknell, who happens to be the founder, CEO and and current president and CEO of Mariner Wealth today.
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I was his salesperson at Fidelity.
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You know, he came to me back in 2014 and said, I need you to come work with me.
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And I said when he said two years ago, so he had already been planning this.
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And so, you know, the role that I’m in now is one of a deep understanding of what we have built over the course of the last 18 years, the importance of culture, what’s important about who we’re looking for, who’s a good match for us and who’s not a good match for us.
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And really then driving success for the organization, helping build enterprise value, you name it.
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All the outcomes of that based on a real personal connection for me of a firm that I helped get started when they were 6 people and 300 million in assets.
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Today we’re north of 1700 employees and 240 billion in assets.
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Something tremendous has grown from that.
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And so I take personal pride and commitment and continue to help that business advance this to this day.
12:58
So kind of ended up where I where I am today as a kind of, you know, a unique set of circumstances, but I truthfully wouldn’t have it any other way.
13:08
That’s an amazing story.
13:09
Has he ever shared with you why he tapped you on the shoulder and said, Kevin, I need you.
13:16
So, you know, at at the risk of naming names, right, So back in 2006 when when Mariner was founded, there were really only two institutional custodial options for somebody that wanted to start an independent RAA.
13:31
It was Fidelity and Schwab.
13:32
He had gone very far down the path with both of us and, and, you know, coming out of those conversations when he ultimately said, Kevin, I’m choosing you.
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It was those exact words.
13:44
It wasn’t I’m choosing fidelity.
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I feel confident and confidence in how far you brought me, what you’ve done and feel that we’re most aligned with continuing to build this by by virtue of partnership with you and and the firm that you work with, which was again, Fidelity at the time.
13:58
Yeah, that’s awesome.
14:00
Now you mentioned culture before is like one of the key elements you’re looking for for a terms of an acquisition.
14:06
You want to make sure you’re getting a good fit.
14:11
Talk to me a little bit about the culture of Mariner and how you’re trying to evaluate potential future acquisitions and, and how they’re going to fit in gel because I’m a huge believer in culture.
14:25
If you’re not aligned there, major problems are going to ensue.
14:29
So I totally get why that’s important.
14:30
But can you talk to us a bit about that?
14:34
Sure.
14:34
And, and look, I’ll kind of sum this up, Chris, by saying that, you know, we have a purpose at Mariner.
14:40
Our purpose is to positively impact the lives of many.
14:44
And, and I’ll share a little bit about what that many means.
14:46
That means the clients we serve, the associates within our organization, but more importantly the communities in which we operate, live and work.
14:54
And, and we do that by virtue of providing our associates tremendous opportunities for personal professional growth, helping cultivate their unique abilities and, and their passion for doing amazing work on behalf of, of our clients.
15:06
And we surround them by a team that supports them and, and hopefully to some extent inspires them.
15:13
And so you know, that’s important.
15:15
And, and while that you know, is, is, is aspirational in many ways and certainly is indicative of what we continue to strive for in terms of protecting that culture.
15:24
When I’m engaged with somebody who’s potentially looking to sell their operating interests in their business to Mariner and I want to hear from them what’s important to them, right.
15:34
If in the first few minutes of those conversations, Chris, it’s what’s in it for me, What am I going to make on this deal?
15:41
How quickly can I retire?
15:42
What is my day-to-day going to look like?
15:44
I’ve already effectively tuned out, OK.
15:47
What’s going to be attractive to me as somebody who talks about their team, their clients, keeping promises to those constituents on a long term basis, far beyond, you know, their their lifespan here in this business, right.
16:02
And and that’s one of the kind of key indicators for me is, is, is how do they talk about what success looks like to them in a, in a deal?
16:10
And when they’re 3rd or 4th or 5th on that list, it really aligns with kind of our core mandate, which is client first, associate second and shareholder last.
16:21
And, and I say that because while those are, you know, catchy words, those are the exact words that Marty used 18 years ago when he described what he envisioned building by virtue of partnership with, with, you know, and, and going independent and partnering with fidelity.
16:37
And, and to this day, if you arrive at our corporate headquarters and get off the 5th floor, you’ll see those very words emblazing on the wall and probably the largest font you could fit on that wall.
16:47
And it’s important to who we are as an organization to continue to protect that culture, to be of a client first mindset.
16:55
And to the extent that as, as I assess any potential acquisition or even an individual advisor who may look to join us, I want to hear those same themes coming from them.
17:05
I want to see that that is embedded in their DNA as to why they’re in this business, what’s important to them and ultimately why they might look to join another firm or or sell their ownership interest to a partner firm.
17:18
Yeah, I love that.
17:20
I absolutely.
17:21
That resonates deeply with me.
17:24
I had another an episode, just a few episodes of sales the Dogwest, a similar question to a leader about like, how do you identify people when you’re hiring?
17:33
What are you looking for?
17:35
And he gave a great answer that when they’re talking about success, it should be in terms of we, the team, what we did as a group.
17:45
When they’re talking about failure, it’s about I, it’s what I did to fail, you know, and it to me that that is what you describe.
17:54
That applies for any leader that if you’re hiring individuals to join your team or doing what you do, it’s the exact same thing.
18:04
You know, because the outcome is you want to build a culture of success.
18:09
And that only is a happening to me when you’ve got the appropriate focus, you know, customer first, we’re going to deliver value, we’re going to have impact.
18:18
I’m going to take care of my team.
18:20
We’re going to take care of the people that really are doing the grunt work day-to-day.
18:24
And then if we’re doing that stuff, we’re going to get what we need as leaders, you know, because we’re doing it the right way.
18:31
Our focus is in the right spot.
18:33
That resonates tremendously with me and I think it will with anyone who’s listening to this that has ever been in any type of leadership role.
18:42
Yeah.
18:42
And Chris, I would just add, look, the the entirety of our business is a service business that’s built on the human capital component.
18:49
If we have good people doing good things for their clients, it’s going to show up in growth of our business, the retention of our clients and the opportunity that we continue to realize as a firm.
18:59
And you know, while I talked about the cultural component, you know, what’s what’s tough is, you know, most of those initial conversations are over Zoom, right?
19:08
And so sometimes it’s harder to kind of extract that out.
19:12
And so while, you know, I can get a pitch from any firm out there, I’m going to ask questions that I think that are going to kind of dig in and, and ultimately result in hearing what I think is is most appropriate.
19:22
But also, you know, leaving some of those initial meetings, I want to leave with a sense of, you know, if we move forward, we’ll be treated as partners and not a vendor.
19:33
And and this would be somebody, an individual that I’d be comfortable saying, hey, come have dinner with me and my wife.
19:38
Right.
19:38
That’s the that’s kind of the, the, the true litmus test, if you will, that I kind of look through the lens of to say this is somebody that I think would be a good fit here, but more importantly, a good ambassador of our brand long term.
19:50
Yeah, that’s awesome.
19:51
I also think that applies to like, you know, for sight, for selling.
19:56
I know in my world when I’m talking to a prospect.
20:00
I’m evaluating like is this prospect is do I have the opportunity to truly become an advisor or partner with them, or are they just going to treat me like a vendor?
20:10
Because if it’s the latter, I’m really not interested because I know I’m not going to have the impact on their business.
20:19
You know, I’m not going to achieve that level of success that we demand out of ourselves, you know, and like I’m not going to be able to succeed if they treat me like a vendor.
20:28
You know, we truly have to become a partner with them.
20:31
And because then if we’re doing that, everyone’s going to succeed and it’s going to be a win win.
20:38
That’s ultimately what we’re looking for, right?
20:40
When we’re any kind of relationship we’re building.
20:43
That’s right.
20:44
That’s right.
20:45
What I think sales becomes the easy part once you’ve established that credibility and that that level of trust and relationship, right.
20:51
Yeah, exactly.
20:54
Were there failures or mistakes you’ve made in the past that have really driven this approach that you have that you use in your day-to-day?
21:01
Now, look, as perhaps unhumble as this will sound, maybe not failures as much as just time and experience in the chair doing the job right and being engaged to a large swath of our industry for as many years as I’ve had, You know, I’ve met the firm founders, owners and operators that I could say just by reputation alone, they would never be a good partner for us, right?
21:30
There are firms whose reputation precedes them and we know they run quality shops and we know they’d be a wonderful fit.
21:37
Those are the just the ones that kind of, you know, bubble up to the top, so to speak, right, right.
21:43
And that that goes to speak like it’s a small world, right?
21:47
And if you’re not doing what you can to protect your reputation, your brand, your message, it’s not going to take long for that word to to get out to the industry, to the customers, the people you’re competing with, people find out.
22:03
Yeah, Chris, that’s a great point.
22:04
And, and, and I would say that that’s something I think that has largely driven you.
22:08
Some of my personal success as well in this, in this industry is at the end of the day, it’s a very small industry.
22:14
I’ve spent enough time in this industry that when I go to big trade shows or events, you know, that that our industry hosts and sponsors, I’ll see 10 to 30 people that I’ve known and worked with for the last 20 something years.
22:28
But what that does is that gives us great connectivity to people who could be a source of referrals for us that may just want to bounce ideas off of me and learn a little bit more about what we’re doing, how we’re doing it.
22:40
Introduce me to somebody that they want us to talk to who may be in the early stages of discovering what’s the best route for their, you know, future succession planning of their business and whether or not we may be a good fit.
22:51
And so to have those embedded relationships and, and to protect those relationships over many, many years and, and decades in many cases, allows me and affords me the ability to, to be introduced to people that I might not otherwise come into contact with.
23:06
And so I think that that integrity and operating with very, very high standards and understanding that it is a very small world and, and perhaps for many of your listeners, a very small industry in which they, they work and operate.
23:17
And you just don’t want to burn bridges.
23:19
You just never know who you’re going to sit in front of one day.
23:22
I like to, I learned that lesson so long ago and never forgot it.
23:28
And it still blows my mind when I’m at a conference that just my rule #1 I teach this to my kids that they probably are tired of hearing it from me, but rule #1 is be nice to everybody.
23:40
And to me, it’s just a good thing, a good role to live by.
23:44
But I also tell them, like, look, people want to help you, but they only want to help people that you know they have good relationships with.
23:53
You never know when you’re going to need help or where that helps going to come from.
23:56
Sometimes you don’t even know you need the help because you’ve done that work to treat everyone with respect, with humility, with grace.
24:05
Build those relationships.
24:07
Like you’re saying, it could be 20 years down the road you run into somebody and they’re like, hey, I’ve been meaning to call you because you need to talk to so and so.
24:15
Blows my mind when that stuff happens.
24:18
And it’s like, you know, if you just got to put good stuff out there, good stuff will come back.
24:23
Yeah.
24:23
No, I love that.
24:24
And and I try and teach my children the same life lessons.
24:27
Right.
24:28
And, you know, whenever I go to the grocery store, run errands or otherwise.
24:32
And.
24:32
And listen, as I mentioned, I live and work here in North Texas, which is probably one of the the friendliest places you could be.
24:38
Everybody talks to everybody.
24:39
My son, who’s almost 10, asks me almost daily.
24:43
Did you know that person?
24:45
No, it just you were talking to them and they knew you or you knew their name.
24:49
Well, Liam, they had a name tag on And, and I just recognize that.
24:52
And that’s important to use people’s names when you talk to them.
24:55
And so I can see he’s picking up on it.
24:57
And I and I promise you one day he may be a future guest on your on your podcast.
25:01
He’ll be a very skilled salesperson at some point in time.
25:04
Yeah, that’s awesome.
25:05
I’m naturally an introvert.
25:07
I’m well, I grew up an incredibly shy person, like until I’m trying to remember like really probably college is when I started to come out of my shell.
25:17
But for years, like if we were in a a social setting, I’m the guy at the back of the room almost hiding, you know, trying to avoid from talking to people.
25:26
But one of the ways I got over that was saying hi to everybody.
25:31
If we’re in an elevator, I’m talking to you.
25:33
If we’re going before passing each other on a trail here in I’m in Colorado, I’m saying, hey, you know, have you’re having a great day, Whatever.
25:42
I’m engaging everybody I can.
25:45
And never ceases to amaze me how you can have some.
25:49
They could have the darkest, gloomiest look on their face and you say hi, how’s your day?
25:54
And they just light up.
25:56
And my kids have had that like, man, dad, that person got so happy when you said hi to them.
26:02
And it’s like sometimes people just need that, you know, you know, And so it’s just like to me, that’s just part of it’s like such a foundational thing in terms of how you live your life.
26:13
You know, that it it never blows.
26:15
It just I love it when I see someone who goes from just I call them clouds and, and, and sunshine.
26:24
Some people, doesn’t matter how you greet them, they’re still going to be a cloud.
26:27
But other people, you think they’re a cloud and they turn into sunshine.
26:30
All you have to do is greet them and say, how’s your day?
26:33
Yeah, no, I couldn’t agree more.
26:35
And I think just kind of living that out day-to-day really transpires and, and becomes when you have those conversations in a sales type of a setting, it’s just more genuine, right?
26:48
People can tell that this is the way you operate, right from walking off the elevator and, and greeting, you know, the receptionist and introducing yourself to, you know, them or somebody else who may walk by you.
27:00
You never know who you’re talking to get in that room, right?
27:04
But I think just putting yourself out there and, and being friendly and, and being welcoming is going to put people at ease to say I’m looking forward to engaging with this person.
27:16
Oh yeah.
27:16
It has to be a core value.
27:18
It has to be core to who you are.
27:20
Again, you said you can’t fake it.
27:21
People will know if you’re faking it.
27:23
And so to me, you have to live that every day.
27:26
You have to be genuine.
27:27
When you have to live with integrity, that has to be a part of your daily routine.
27:30
It’s not a switch you can flip on or off.
27:33
Mm.
27:33
Hmm.
27:34
Yeah.
27:34
Yeah.
27:34
And look, you never know.
27:35
I mean, that receptionist could have the ear of the CEO of whomever you’re you’re selling to.
27:39
And.
27:40
And they may walk out of there and having just met with your competitor or meeting with your competitor.
27:45
But that one piece of feedback from somebody who said, you know, that guy was really nice who came in, he asked me how my day was going.
27:51
Could be what turns it in your favor.
27:53
You just never know.
27:53
And vice versa.
27:55
You see, that person was so rude to me, blah, blah, blah.
27:58
And it could go the exact opposite way.
28:00
Of course.
28:01
Of course.
28:01
Yeah, yeah.
28:02
No, it’s amazing.
28:04
And So what else?
28:07
What advice do you have for a listener that maybe like, I want to change our culture.
28:14
I want to improve our culture.
28:17
What advice do you have for them?
28:20
Oh, gosh, that’s a that’s a big one.
28:22
You know, listen, I think early on I was taught by a mentor, a good close friend of mine, continue to work with him to this day.
28:34
He said to me one time, and this may be very Texan, but it was you get more bees with honey than you do vinegar.
28:39
So true.
28:40
And that, and that stood out to me because in every interaction that I had from a professional standpoint, whether it be a potential client, a prospect or somebody internally that was to deliver something that ultimately was going to help get that, you know, to a close or otherwise.
28:59
You have to treat those people with the utmost respect.
29:01
You have to treat those people as integral to your success.
29:04
And, and knowing that, you know, those relationships, the deeper you build them and the more that you, you really foster the, the relationships and the time spent with the people who directly support you.
29:18
When I pick up the phone, when I send an e-mail and call or ask for something, I promise you they, they get right back to me, right?
29:24
But I’ve, but I’ve earned that trust and that respect and admiration from them because I treat them as a, as a integral part of our team and not just somebody who’s there to do some busy work and, and get me the report I need or whatever it is, right?
29:39
And, and I and I do believe that that is something that if people are new into the sales profession, they should learn and understand that and it, it will convey, you know, really, I think respect for the team at large and help position them for future success.
29:55
And and when when they need something from somebody, they’re going to get what they need is quicker than maybe most, right?
30:01
Yep.
30:02
Yeah, I’ve mentioned this several, several episodes of sales lead dog and my team probably gets tired of hearing me say this stuff too.
30:08
But to me, a leaders out front leading by example, the manager is someone in the back with a stick whacking.
30:15
You know, it’s an analogy of a sheep herder.
30:17
Are you leading the herd from the front or are you in the back with a stick whacking them, trying to get them to go in the direction you want them to go in?
30:23
It’s much harder to do when you’re trying to push and control and drive them in the direction versus being out front and truly leading by example where they’re willingly following you.
30:36
Yeah.
30:36
And and the other thing I would say here too is, is that, you know, these from a leadership standpoint, these are the people that ultimately want to matriculate in their career up to the next level.
30:45
And so it’s not just, hey, Chris, can you send me the pro forma on that thing?
30:50
I’m going to come back to you and say, hey, Chris, here’s kind of where the deal is and here’s what we’re looking at.
30:54
And here’s some unique, you know, nuances or whatever.
30:57
And I’m going to get your buy into, oh, this is this is of interest.
31:01
This is something that we may want to, you know, win and, and, and be successful in and so having that two way communication and sharing with them necessary updates and things that are crucial to continue to be successful as a team.
31:15
They welcome all that.
31:15
I think they’re very hungry for that.
31:17
They want to get out of their little box as much as possible and learn more about the overall process and and perhaps where they may end up one day.
31:25
Exactly.
31:25
It’s a great way to foster development and get people to, like you’re saying, come out of their box a bit and maybe go in some directions they never considered or maybe weren’t all that comfortable with.
31:35
But it’s a great way to foster that development and growth that otherwise it’s just not going to happen.
31:40
Eventually you’re going to lose good people because they’re stuck in a rut.
31:44
You know, you have to give them those opportunities to succeed and fail.
31:50
Shifting our conversation here just a little bit, CRM, do you love it or do you hate it?
31:57
We happen to love it.
31:58
We, we live in it and, and it is really for us, the source of truth in a very, very busy deal world and certainly a very active deal environment right now in my industry, keeping close tabs on where any particular deal stands, who, who’s working on the finance piece, the integration piece, whatever the CRM is the source of truth.
32:21
So much of our reporting comes out of that both reporting for, you know, kind of what’s next, what, where, where are there open items that need to be addressed?
32:32
But also more importantly, when you think about it from a standpoint of reporting up.
32:36
And so, you know, ultimately as, as we sit here in the, in the world of capital allocation of firm resources to go out and acquire firms and, and more importantly acquire talent, knowing where we stand at any given point with offers made and with, with deal terms that are out there is super, super important to our executive leadership team.
32:56
And so if it’s not in CRM, I used to be told 20 years ago, it didn’t happen, right.
33:01
And and I do believe that that is something that, you know, while it’s, while it’s an administrative task, right?
33:07
And people don’t like updating things.
33:10
The moment somebody comes to you and asks you for a status on a deal and, and you happen to be busy or can’t remember, and you can point back to notes records in ACRM or updates or otherwise, it’s just going to be a, a, a better experience for everybody, right?
33:27
And that’s thing that like we emphasize, like if you know, because adoption is so important, any technology platform and CRM is no different.
33:39
But we really try to convey to people that the CRM is not just for you and it’s not just busy work.
33:47
There are critical strategic and tactical decisions being made on the information that’s in CRM.
33:53
And if the data is crap, it’s tough to make good decisions based upon that data, right?
33:59
And so everybody has to own their piece and do their part.
34:02
So again, the team can work truly as a team and function in an optimal way.
34:09
Absolutely.
34:10
Yeah.
34:10
What how do you guys built, how do you extend your culture into CRM?
34:17
That’s a good question.
34:20
Look, I think a big part of our culture is accountability and keeping promises.
34:28
There’s, there’s two of our core values right there that kind of define who we are as an organization.
34:34
Utilizing a tool like ACRM to keep the necessary updates in, to keep the team honest, to keep everybody apprised of where things stand at any given time creates an opportunity for people to to have trust and confidence in what they, what they can view in that CRM.
34:50
And so when they are asked to give an answer to somebody, whether it be internal or external, having the confidence to say this is where we stand allows them to be better at their job, right.
35:02
And so I think that’s that’s part of it.
35:04
So that’s, that’s maybe two small components of our culture.
35:07
But a great way to kind of measure and assess is, is the CRM component just to your example.
35:13
Yeah, I have a question.
35:14
I’m going to let you pick how you answer it in terms of would you be willing to share with us maybe a current struggle you’re having with CRM or if it’s a previous struggle you’ve had with CRM, how you overcame that struggle?
35:28
Yeah.
35:29
I think we’ve operated in a world of CRM where it was very basic and we’ve continued to enhance it based on really our feedback as as employees that are all on kind of the deal team.
35:42
And so when you start to get much more active and you have different nuances to deals and, and there are as an example, reasons you may have passed on or lost a deal to have a very, very granular level of reporting on that.
35:57
To be able to track the investment bankers who are sending us deals on the regular, who we’re having more success with versus who we’re not really helps us make better decisions down the road.
36:07
But in the absence of having that data, that empirical sort of evidence, if you will, and, and years of history of it, we wouldn’t be in the position that we are today to say, you know, the, this is where we’re going to spend our time on deals.
36:19
This is what’s, you know, probably a high indicator of success for us on other deals that we see.
36:25
And more importantly, while we’re one of the largest and most acquisitive firms in our industry and, and candidly people are coming out of the woodwork to bring us deals, we’re going to focus on the ones that are truly the best opportunities for us.
36:40
And that typically comes from the firms that know us best, know who we are, what’s important to us and bring us the best, most aligned deals.
36:48
And having that data in CRM year after year to look at where we’ve had success, where we’re going to continue to concentrate our efforts is just helpful to have that as as good empirical evidence outside of the relationships that we’ve developed with, with many of those people, you know, really on the front end.
37:04
Yeah, that’s awesome.
37:07
I, I love how you answered that because it applies in so many areas.
37:12
Like, you know, that one of the key benefits of CRM is having that insight because you can focus on the whole world, but it’s hard to be successful when you’re focused on everything.
37:25
You just can’t.
37:26
There’s no way to be successful if you’re chasing every deal.
37:29
You need to focus on what’s going to be those deals that are going to be truly the win wins, the ones that are going to be best to drive your strategic goals, your key initiatives.
37:40
That’s where your focus needs to be.
37:42
And that’s what CRM, when it’s done right, can really help support and drive.
37:46
It’s really tough to do without a good CRM.
37:50
I would agree.
37:51
I would agree 100%.
37:52
Yeah, that’s awesome.
37:53
I appreciate your candor today, Kevin, in in answering my questions.
37:59
I really appreciate you coming out.
38:00
Unfortunately, this is one of those episodes I could just keep going with you, but we’ve run out our time here on this episode.
38:06
Kevin, if people want to reach out, connect with you, they want to learn more about Mariner, what’s the best way for them to do that?
38:12
Yeah.
38:12
So if you would be so kind, Chris, as to post my LinkedIn to your, your podcast.
38:17
That’s probably the best place for people to to learn about me and to learn about more importantly our firm and and how we serve the clients that we are fortunate enough to serve.
38:25
Really appreciate you inviting me on.
38:27
This has been fun, hopefully additive to you and to your audience and and much appreciate your time today.
38:33
Yeah, no, this is great.
38:34
This was again, I go back to the beginning.
38:37
People were like, why are you having Kevin on?
38:39
He’s not acro or VP of sales.
38:43
His answer is he tells you he tells you why.
38:45
I think you can understand now why we want to come in to come on sales lead doc.
38:50
And another part about this for me is there’s not just one path if you want to be in sales leadership.
38:58
And so this to me, you’re a great example of people that might be wondering, geez, where can I go in my career?
39:04
I think you’re a great example of what you can do when you you do it the right way.
39:09
Well, I appreciate the the trust and confidence and having me on your podcast to to share a little bit.
39:14
Don’t worry about my story.
39:15
So thank you.
39:16
Yeah.
39:16
So if you want to get Kevin’s LinkedIn profile, get that link.
39:20
You can get that in our show notes.
39:22
Go to impellercrn.com/sales lead dog where you’ll get not only this episode of sales a lot lead dog, but also our hundred plus other episodes.
39:30
So be sure to check that out, subscribe.
39:32
So you get all our future episodes.
39:35
Kevin, thanks again for coming on Sales Lead Dog and welcome to the Sales Lead Dog pack.
39:40
My pleasure.
39:41
Thanks, Chris.
39:45
As we end this discussion on Sales Lead Dog, be sure to subscribe to catch all our episodes on social media.
39:52
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39:56
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40:03
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